Lucas Rocher's Interview

– What do we need to know about you when we don't know who you are?
– But who? A music listener? A stranger in the bus?
– Rather the people I call the Appreciators.
– I was born in October, so I'm Libra. I've been making songs, accompanied by a guitar, for a number of years. I was in a trio for about ten years, in the humorous song scene. And now I alternate between humorous and more nostalgic songs, in a solo show.

– Are your lyrics autobiographical?
– Not only, but yes, tinged with life experiences, not necessarily mine. Experience is a great fuel to know what you are talking about and to talk about it with relevance.
– Do you write your songs based on the lyrics first? Is this your writing process?
– Yes, always.
– And then you find the melody?
– We're all a bit of melodists, because the intonations, the ruptures... Sometimes you just have to read the text to realize that the caesura should be placed here, that you are going to go to the high-pitched on such and such a sentence end... Intention dictates the musical composition.
– And the chords come after the melodies, to sustain them?
– Yes, and also to tint a few sentences with sweetness, mischief, nostalgia, or unsubtlety.

– Volo, Wriggles, Joyeux Urbains, Lily Luca, Guilhem Valayé, Fatals Picards, Oldelaf... That's a lot of singer-songwriters with acoustic guitars who make intelligent songs that are more or less funny, and who participate in each other's records... Is it a tribe? Are you friends?
– Yes, it's a bit of a tribe. For some, we've been meeting in small or medium-sized venues for 10 years. Others like Volo, Oldelaf, the Wriggles, Joyeux Urbains, are people that I listened to, that I learned by heart, about whom I even sometimes learned to develop my guitar playing. And today it's an honour to have had Oldelaf in a video, to have had a Joyeux Urbain in a track of my album, to have opened several times for Volo, to have one of Volo for co-writing, to have also been a favourite of the Wriggles when they were Francofans editor-in-chief. For me, the circle is complete because these are people who have influenced me, who have nourished me, there is a kind of passing of the torch.
Guilhem Valayé is the producer of Premium, and he just released a very good album, we're pretty good friends yes.

– I've read on social media about the setbacks that happen to the independent singer that you are, and probably to many others too, namely a bar owner who refuses to pay for a performance that was a big success yet. What should be put in place to avoid this, to help independent singers?
– Actually, in France, there are already so many measures in place to guarantee even 1 fee for a musician. The problem is that in recent years there have been a lot more musicians with the development of Computer-Assisted Music, and we find ourselves with bands that agree to play under any conditions. Especially for free, without being reimbursed for expenses, without having to drink or eat when they arrive, and they fill the bar with friends – because they are often semi-professionals who are already so happy to play. I'm not even talking about cover bands: Queen Tribute or Téléphone Tribute evenings, they’re packed. It's discouraging for programmers who try to bring in songwriters they respect a lot, and who go to great lengths to put up posters, put up leaflets, etc.
Here, what caught my attention was the “We're already very kind to leave you a scene”. We want to answer “We're very kind to bring you an people, who are themselves very nice to drink in your bar, etc.” It's a bit humiliating to remind people that it's a job, and to be sneered at when you're simply asking for a guaranteed minimum, and you're just a little bit aware of what a bar's turnover is for an evening. A few years ago, we could be guaranteed €200 or €300, even in very small places, even in cash or whatever... Today it's “Well, we'll see, and then maybe we'll pass a hat...”
Since I've been solo, it's easier than in a trio in terms of negotiation. On the other hand, pretending to be a heavy is less easy when I'm all alone... and light. Maybe I should take up boxing.

– You lead song workshops in middle schools. Has it been a long time?
– I was a guitar teacher for 10 years in a major music school in Paris called Polynotes, with whom I share a lot of values such as highlighting practice, doing quirky workshops. And I lead courses for middle school students, not in middle schools but in music schools, where I make them work on musical accompaniment. That is to say for a week they will discover my songs, which they don't know, and find their place in them (strings, brass, drummers...) to do a concert 5 days later. It means at the same time standing on stage, knowing how to accompany, knowing how to play in a band, presenting a show, staging it, finding ideas for inter-songs... Everything I like. I love music and arrangement in general.

– Artificial Intelligence now seems to be able to generate songs that hold water. How can we fight? Should we fight?
– I made a joke about it not so long ago because under a pseudonym I released a fake right-wing musical, which is called "Cancel, the Musical". I generated a whole bunch of songs that would have cost me a budget of, I think, a good €150,000 if I had had to pay for a real orchestra and 28 backup singers etc. I did it just to discover, to practice, because it made my friends laugh. They are the ones who pushed me to do it. I have a lot of music in my computer that I don't release. I must have 5, 6, 7 hours of music just to make my friends laugh for 10 years. A project will be released this year, it's going to be called "Lundi Cauchemar", with a sound fiction, short films, videos... I believe in this project very much, I have been working on it for 3 years.
Artificial Intelligence suits me when, as a scriptwriter, I tell it “Make me a list of props” or “Remind me how many times this character appears”. On the other hand, when people think they've composed a song, or when graphic designers think they've created images, while all of them are generated pieces... The confusion is almost on the side of the creators. See, Jean-Michel Blanquer [former French minister (Translator’s Note)] had said on the radio: “I brought a piece that I did. Well I didn't write the lyrics, I didn't really make the music”... You didn't do anything, guy! You generated something and you dared to go for it.
It's destabilizing, because there are jobs that will quickly be damaged, such as voice-over, for example. I'm also quite tired of the feedback from big publishing companies that relied on lyricists... You see, Florent Pagny is making his new album, until now they were looking for songs from a guy who is a bit famous and who has his guitar or his piano. And now they generate 80 pieces a day and tell Florent to draw. So I think it's more in the attitude we have towards AI, than AI itself. It's fascinating.
– The question is: what is the future of art and creativity in this?
– Absolutely. As long as AI remains an assistant and the difference is made... Today for example it's not a very good screenwriter and it's not a very good lyricist, but for how long?
– And it's zero in humour.
– I agree with you. And maybe one of the few nice things, as people will tell themselves that they don't need to learn music anymore, those who will still know how to play it, and to improvise, it's going to create something. Live music will be even crazier.
AI is an ecological disaster too, it's a real issue.
– Data centres that overheat behind...
– Yes, that's right. Before AI we were already saying we had to slow down energy consumption, and now something is happening, which requires 4 times more, there is a moment it will be very concrete. And then the price of energy etc. This is a vast debate. I'm not very optimistic about the future of this.
Preparing new songs, dealing with drunk people, the not so great sound, the bars where people talk, the more rock places, the more punk places... It's all a job. AI does not allow this gain in off-road experience, in muscle in fact.

– I suggest you look at the list of albums reviewed on japprecie and point out 5 that you particularly like.
• Oldelaf
• Les Goguettes because I was in the band, I was Valentin Vander's understudy, I toured for 2 years
• Émilie Simon, I like her soundtrack of March of the Penguins
• Agnes Obel
• Volo
– Do you have any other artists to suggest to the Appreciators?
Guilhem Valayé and Nans Vincent: they are the ones who set up the Bleu Pinces label.